Did the MonBike Clubbers think $60 was too much because they think they don't need the class? How many of them came to the when it was almost/actually free? Was the low low price persuasive at all?
As for my lack of attendance, there *has been* a disconnect between the value I put on the weekends versus the perceived value of the giving up one of those weekends to take the course. My thinking was "well, I'm getting to work and around town just fine and when things break, either john will fix it or the bike store guys or I'll read the manual....when it actually breaks, whenever that will be. So, I'll just keep scraping the paint off my house every night and weekend." I don't have boredom/down time, so the class needed to seem valuable enough to command priority among my many interests. Instead, it seemed like something that would "be there when I got around to it" which I never did.
So, can ya'll list the all the skills gained and we'll try to put a number to how many hours you'll save by taking the class?
aira
On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 3:02 PM, Gunnar Shogren gshogren@gmail.com wrote:
Fact is- How many of those folks from the Mon Bike Club ride that said 60$ was too much came for a class? Skiing is (I would say) a *completely* different demographic compared to the "learn to bike properly" crowd. Might not be different from say "learn how to train for your first century" or "get fit for your first Tri" crowd or something like that, but I just don't think it's viewed as the same from the "people". Sure we all know that it's really important and really helpful, but unless we get that word across to folks, it just doesn't appear to be. How many of this list *have* taken the course? 100%? And why not? Too much $$, not enough worth, too much time, you already know it all? Well maybe that's the same for the population too.
Wish I had answers. I think 60$ is max for around here, but there *has* to be a real perceived value. We gotta work on that.
My .02$
On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 2:48 PM, Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@gmail.com wrote:
On Feb 9, 2011, at 2:25 PM, Aira Loren Burkhart wrote:
Well, who do we want to attend the class, or who do we think might
possibly
be persuaded to bicycle who isn't already?
Good question. My first response is: everybody. If I had to segment
and
prioritize, my first rough target would be those that would make the
biggest
switch to riding their bikes from driving their cars. Now, who would
they
be? I'll just throw out a couple of guesses: people who:
- have experienced the joy and freedom of cycling but find some
impediments
to riding now
- can tolerate getting somewhere a few minutes later than driving or
being
driven
- are in fair or better physical condition
- want to drive their cars less
that's the heart of the marketing problem.
who's our target? students? (what kind?) people who live within 2 miles of school or work? the eldery? the unhealthy who want to be healthy? triathletes? runners? people with bike racks on their cars? flyers on any and all bicycles seem parked around town?
if we could decide who we wanted to attend the class (cyclists or noncyclists), we could figure out how to reach them.
aira
On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 2:20 PM, Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@gmail.com
wrote:
That's easy for him to "say". The issue is what is there about the
course
that would want to make people tell other people about it? Frank On Feb 9, 2011, at 2:13 PM, Aira Loren Burkhart wrote:
one more note, Andrew Walker thinks we should, per his text message, "Go more viral, grassroots."
If anyone has thoughts on what that might mean, apart from or in additional to papering the town in hip illustrated posters, I'd like to
hear
your thoughts.
aira
On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 2:07 PM, Aira Loren Burkhart <
airaloren@gmail.com>
wrote:
My friend Sommer (a designer in Dallas) thinks that if we initially charge, we can also then have coupons or vouchers. "Buy a bike, get
free
lessons, a $100 value!" Might help sell some bicycles too!
$45 is okay, but [confession] John and I paid $190 a person for a
weekend
of all day ski lessons a fee weeks ago. "For $190 a person, it better
be
good!" was what I said.... and it was!
I think most people care more about saving time than saving money. The ski class advertised "Improve your skiing by 3-5 years in a weekend."
Now,
that's value! The CCC course offers the same kind of knowledge,
eliminating
years of trial and error. So, we should pitch it more from that angle.
"save 3-5 years" justifies a substantial price, doesn't it?
there were 15-20 people in the ski class and every one said they'd persuade friends to take it in the future. the price definitely didn't
hurt
enrollment.
aira
On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 1:56 PM, Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@gmail.com
wrote:
I agree with Aira and Chip. The question is, how much should we
charge
to get the most people to take the course? If we're going to change
the
price, we must change it ASAP since we already have pricing info on
the
course calendar.
Here's how I arrived at the current $45 price. Three years ago,
before
I started teaching Traffic Skills 101, I did a very cursory search of
the
web for other cities' pricing. I found prices at 3 cities. Prices
ranged
from $30 to $90. $90 was in CA. $30 was in NC. So, I set a strawman
price
of $60. Then, on rides with MonBikeClub cyclists, I asked 6 riders separately what they thought of the $60 price. A couple said it was
too
high but $30-35 seemed reasonable. I set the price at $45. I think it would be an excellent idea for someone to do more research
on
prevailing pricing. Just FYI, if we teach 4 participants/class with 2 instructors getting paid $25/hr, we'd have to charge $163/participant to break even
(includes
text books and other necessary expenses). If we had 8 participants,
we
would break even at $89/participant. So, Ryan, don't get your hopes
up for
a pay raise. (Remember, the grant absorbs losses.) So, what should we charge? Frank
On Feb 8, 2011, at 5:41 PM, Ryan Post wrote:
Ya, I’m fine with that, then you can pay the instructors more!
That principle was actually talked about during the LCI class, put a value on something and people want it more. However, I’d still argue
that
it doesn’t matter if they don’t know about the course. So problem is
still
getting word out. I wonder if businesses are willing to incorporate
it into
their bonus programs? I know my old company required everyone to take
some
extra classes to get bonuses.
On Feb 8, 2011, at 5:40 PM, Chip Wamsley wrote:
---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Aira Loren Burkhart airaloren@gmail.com Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 17:35:32 -0500
I agree with Aira, putting a value on the course is important and if people pay, they will show up. I think we are already requiring folks
to
pay first, and then complete the course to get money back--correct? Chip
From: Aira Loren Burkhart [mailto:airaloren@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 5:36 PM To: chip@wamsleycycles.com Cc: Jim Rye; Gunnar Shogren; Marilyn Newcome; Ryan Post; Elizabeth Shogren; Hugh.Kierig@mail.wvu.edu; chip wamsley; Don Spencer; Paul
Becker;
Frank Gmeindl; Bicycle Board Subject: Re: Course participation
I know this will sound funny, but maybe this course should cost more?
(I'm just brainstorming, so you might disagree)
There is definitely a psychology to pricing and making the course free/very cheap might be making it seem like it's not an important
class or
like the content is low quality or something.
Maybe the course should be advertised as costing $100 or another high number more similar to classes people pay to take, like dancing, or
music,
or art classes? Charging a lot might make it seem exclusive and
legitimize
the course content.
I think people pay more attention and have better attendance when they have already committed their money to something. They have to then
"get
their money's worth" by working hard and focusing. People sell out
expensive
rock concerts but you can't expect to "pack the park" for a free
community
concert. And that's because it's free, not because the content is
different.
Is this making sense to anyone else?
"You get what you pay for" and so far, no one is getting [from us]
what
they aren't paying for, right?
So, let's charge a lot for it and see if people would prefer to pay to play.
aira
On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at 5:16 PM, Chip Wamsley chip@wamsleycycles.com wrote: ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Frank Gmeindl fgmeindl@gmail.com Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 15:52:54 -0500
Frank et al,
I think the new business cards will be a help, 1) if bike board
members
hand them out to friends to direct them to the website to get the CCC
class
schedule--I'll be able to use lots at the shop 2) an 8 1/2 x 11 poster
on
heavier paper that could be put up at the bike shops, rec center,
coop,
moose, black bear, laundromats, around campus etc. . . to briefly
describe
course and drive people to the class--the same poster in slide form on
the
city TV channel should also work well.
Chip
Education Committee members,
The Mar - Sep 2010 courses are scheduled at http://bikemorgantown.com/calendar.php . Recommendations for
getting
people to attend?
Ads in the Dominion Post and Daily Athenaeum might make sense
although
I'd say last year, the ad in the paper actually brought less than 4 participants.
Other ideas?
Frank
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